Why Do We Need to Be in Control? Fear, Safety & Letting Go

You are listening to The Awakening Woman on the Rise. If you are a woman who is seeking to live

a more authentic life but are feeling not enough to step out fully just yet, you are in the right

place. If you are a woman who is looking to live your personal truth and make the impact you truly

desire, you are in the right place. I'm your host, Wendy Yitbossi. Let's step out in this together.

So welcome to session two and I have a wonderful surprise for you and that is that I am joined by

a very good friend and colleague, Danielle Benzon, and we are discussing day-to-day topics

that not only come up for us but I bet they come up for you too. So I invite you to listen to each

episode, see what sparks for you, and take it from there. Welcome everybody to Wisdom Wednesdays

with Wendy and Danielle and today we are going to talk about control. I'm really excited about this.

We're going to control the situation. Wendy, thank you for being here today with me as always.

Yes, thank you so much, Danielle. I always look forward to it. We play so well together.

We do. It's almost like that's all we're doing,

which is the opposite of control, I feel like. Control's great.

Play and control are kind of, well, I don't know. Are those opposites? What do you think?

Play and control, yes, I do think they're opposites.

Yeah, because it has to be an element of like chaos and surprise with play.

Yes, exactly. And that's the thing, is to know am I really in play or am I controlling play?

That reminds me of one time, one time, one time, that reminds me of a friend of mine I had who

he was in control of the schedule at the theater and he would schedule fun time and we just all

thought that was just hilarious. Like, there's a scheduled fun time where I have fun right now.

We all thought that was really funny. Part of the schedule is like,

I will control this play. We will play now and we will work later.

And actually, that might be another topic, is play. Not today, because we're controlling today.

But it is important to make time for play, which can feel like control, but it's not.

It's just prioritizing. But that's not what we're talking about today.

No, no, it's not.

We're going to control the topic.

It is so attractive. It's play is so attractive because it's allowing, which control is not allowing.

So when I think of control, I think of like rigid boundaries. I think of a limit.

I think of limits when I think of control. I think of this is what we're not doing.

It's a very kind of rigid, kind of limited structure.

And where does control show up? Because obviously control is a big thing.

In what context would you like to discuss control?

Well, I'd like to discuss it in various ways, because I agree with you absolutely, Danielle.

And one of the things that comes up for me about controlling is actually fear,

which leads to the limiting, which leads to, because I mean, think about it.

If and when you discount yourself, or if and when I discount myself, I do it because I want to

control possible loss. I want to control possible embarrassment. I want to control

some kind of possible negativity that's running. Because why else would I control?

So you're talking about controlling your environment and other people,

which is actually impossible. It's an illusion.

Because this idea that we can control the outcome of something, or that we can control how someone

else feels or what someone else thinks about us is garbage. This is not true. We can pretend.

We pretend. And we pretend very well that we're in control of what other people think of us.

If I present myself a certain way, they will think this thing.

You honestly, we actually have so little control over other people, over our environments,

a little bit more over our environments, depending on how technically you want to get,

we can build buildings and things. But we don't have any control over the weather,

we don't have any control over whether or not someone else is late. We don't have any,

none of it is under our control. And I think this is where superstitions and things come from.

And why we get kind of committed to negative thoughts sometimes, because it becomes like

a superstition. Well, if I nag this person, then they will do this thing. Or if I think of it this

way, if I worry about all of the outcomes, then I can control the outcome more. It's like I'm

putting effort in and my effort equals something. But when it's that kind of effort, that's just,

it's a lie. It's just a lie. Well, it is. And I think that it's our own

rationalization that we, whatever I can feel comfortable with, right? And when I feel

comfortable, I feel safe. And when I feel safe, then I feel in control. And you know, you're,

yeah, you're absolutely right. So when you feel safe, you feel in control,

not when you feel in control, you feel safe. Because I thought I would have flipped those.

I would have said like, I control things in order to feel safe. Because I don't feel safe in the

chaos of the universe, in the uncertainty of life. And I used to be the type of person who scheduled

my life a whole year in advance, and I tried to control everything. And then COVID came.

And I, and I learned, and it was wonderful for me, because I have anxiety. So I do,

I try to control everything in order to lower my anxiety. And something happened,

I just kind of surrendered to the chaos of the universe. And I went, you know what,

I'm going to live a week at a time. And then now I live like three months at a time. But I don't

live more than three months at a time now. And I love it. But I would 10 years ago, if you told

me that I would have been not a chance in hell, I need to control everything. But now I'm that

surrender, like I can control my emotions. Well, I don't control my emotions. I'm in relationship

with my emotions. I can control my actions. And that's enough. And I quite like that.

Like bringing it down to the absolutely personal. Yeah, exactly. I think that that is a good point

that the only thing we can control is how, how we respond or react or, or whatever it is,

you know, you mentioned about control and safety and safety and control.

I don't think they're separate. Ah, I think that, however, we function,

I know that for me, safety has been a really important motivator in my life. I was just

reading something this morning in A Course in Miracles about how, when there's something that

we really want, and actually a part of us feels quite vulnerable about it, we will

um, diminish it by not calling it what it is, like how I really feel what I really want,

because that feels unsafe. That feels because when I feel unsafe, I don't feel in control,

I feel vulnerable. And that is why I will try to control by maybe saying, Oh, it's not really that

important if it happens, okay, if it doesn't, okay, which is a great, you know, kind of thing,

you know, to help us maybe move through something. But the truth is, you know what,

this freaking really matters to me, I don't have to give all my power away to it. But what if I

can just acknowledge that it's important to be and not have to control it in such a way is that if

the worst happens, I'm done. You know, it's, yeah, maybe there's a different

resilience that can be developed through not controlling, but through just calling it what

it is being honest about it. And so, yeah, yeah. Yeah, like radical acceptance. Yeah. So from what

I'm hearing, it's interesting, because I have very different relationship with these words than you.

And so what I'm hearing from you is that you use control to stop yourself from being hurt,

to keep yourself and that so I don't use the word safe in that I feel very safe. And if I'm I can be

safe and in pain. You know, like, I know, it's weird, right? I have a different relationship

with the word safety. For me. So it's so interesting. You know, a lot of the times,

I think a lot of us conflate that safety with not being hurt. Safety with not being vulnerable safety

with with being with feeling okay. And that's so interesting, because, for me, my feelings and my

safety are different. They're separate. I often don't feel okay. When I am safe. And I often

Yeah, I often don't feel okay when I am physically safe. But also I can be the other way. You know,

I can feel okay when I'm not safe. I don't know. Like, it's a very weird for me,

my emotions are completely different thing. So I just find that so interesting.

That we spend so much energy. And I think this is true of our society.

We spend so much energy just avoiding pain. Like I will do anything to avoid feeling hurt

or ashamed or embarrassed in any way. And I think that's very limiting.

Yeah, well, and there's so many ways that we can do that, too. I mean, probably a lot of people that

would be listening to this podcast are people that have either would like to start their own

business or would like to live a passion or have started whatever that is. And yet,

better life. Well, that's right. And what can happen is, and I've experienced this myself,

and I've witnessed other people experiencing this on various opportunity calls to invest

is that, that in the chat, people are saying, my husband won't let me or I can't because and

I said, you know, that that's an interesting thing to see that as a control. The control

feature is, is that if my husband or boyfriend or whoever won't let me spend that much money,

I'm safe. That's my word. Again, I'm saying, Yeah, I don't have to find a way to make it work. I

don't have to go, thank you for your opinion, but I'm doing it. You know, I'm not saying this is

an easy decision, believe me, because sometimes the things that we're concerned about doing

could be very actually real. But it's interesting how there are so many ways that we can control

any possible sense of failure, of loss, of, of scariness. And, yeah,

and if we're going to do that, we have in order to feel that kind of safe, and in order to feel that

version of safe, we have to stay in the familiar, which means we will never do anything new.

Yeah. And that's kind of death to me. That's kind of like, that's like a death sentence. Like,

wow, I'm going to be doing this as like, or like, maybe limbo, you know, I'm going to be doing

exactly the same thing forever. Because I'm not, I'm not risking anything. But I'm also, I'm,

I also committing to feeling stuck, or whatever it is, you know, like, I mean, unless you if you love

your life, that's fine. But then you're not, then it's not a safe control thing. Yeah, I'm

trying to do this. But also, I wanted to say, it's very interesting what you said about, you know,

people are offered an opportunity. And it can kind of, I think, go both ways, you know, when

they say like, Oh, well, I can't, I can't, because my boyfriend won't let me or I can't, because

whatever. It's so interesting that you're, you're giving up your autonomy. It's not I can't,

it's not I don't want to. Yeah, it's so the ownership is gone. I can't because some other

external force is stopping me. What if that actually, sometimes that's a, you know, being

controlled by someone else. But also, sometimes, that's a way of not wanting to be vulnerable,

because I don't want to own that. I don't want to do this thing. Exactly. And that's the difference

between blaming it on someone else. Exactly. I can't as opposed to I won't. No, no, thank you.

And the thing is, you know, when I think about the term, I won't do such and such owning that

there's no control in that there, there's a sense of self ownership, I think, is a sense of honesty.

But, but, but somehow, even though there can be a not a confidence that that's not the word I want

to use, but in in the owning the the the won't, to me, that opens up a person to,

to well, exactly, it's vulnerable. Well, yeah, and it's, it's, oh, my goodness, it's my choice. It's

because you're owning the choice. You're acknowledging the choice, which means that it's a

choice, which means you can do either. You can change the outcome, which means that you have

the power to change the outcome. So for me, I actually think like, that's, that's kind of

acknowledging the control that you have over yourself and over the universe, you know, kind

of being like, I own this, I am in control. You know, but for some people, I think they would feel

less in control, because they feel vulnerable. And as soon as we say something like, this choice is

mine. If we aren't comfortable standing up for ourselves, and standing in our power and saying

no, when we want to, we open ourselves up to other people feeling like they can manipulate us,

or feeling like we can be talked into something, or browbeaten or manipulated. And I think that's

why we tend to blame other people for our choices. Because we don't want to own the choice. Because

if we own the choice, then we have to own the fact that we made the choice. And it is actually what

we want. Yeah, exactly. I would I really want to, but I can't. Yeah, it's a lie.

Get out of my head.

No, seriously, I, you know, I have compassion, more compassion for others. Another good topic,

but I have more compassion for others that, that are in and I can't place than I am with myself.

And I don't know, maybe we don't need to go into that a lot right now. But But,

but what I do want to say is that when I say, I won't. When I have said I won't what I what I've

realized is that in some ways, there's a part of me that needs to trust something else. And and by

that, I mean, if I acknowledge that something so won't right now, there's a part of me that says,

Okay, so what else is possible? And for me, the spiritual part comes up, because if I believe

that there's something greater than me, whatever it's called, whatever I call it,

it's, it's also about not control, it's about being receptive to what is possible. And

because, you know, I know, just to say that there have been times where I have feared

someone else's control. Because growing up, and a good part of my life, I felt I felt controlled,

I couldn't, I didn't feel able, I wasn't strong enough inside to make my own decisions. And so

in some ways, I projected their control on me, but I was the one that was not yet able to make

my own decisions. And so, you know, there was a part of me, again, being transparent here,

that I feared that something greater energetically, because I was afraid that if I listened

to inspiration, or whatever it is, that I would now be giving it control of my life.

Interesting. I'm just sharing, I, you know,

no, that's, yeah, I think, I think, I think a lot of us go through life.

And and we don't necessarily think of it this way. But think about how many people feel obligated to

do certain things, like obligated to your spouse, obligated to your family, obligated to work.

And you do feel, and this is where resentment comes from. When, you know, we feel like we're

not free to make our own choices. We're not. But I think most of us actually live in that state

without realizing it. You know, it's, it's not like that this is this crazy thing, like,

we're other people controlling us all the time. We, and they're not, we are, but we are, we are

kind of controlling ourselves on their behalf. So there's, there's so much of that going on.

And like you were saying, like, and it's a pattern that we learn. So, you know, when you

were younger, maybe you didn't have autonomy, because, you know, legal rights and all that

kind of stuff. But then that becomes a pattern that you take on. And then you, you live, you

live with that. So you take other people's, you know, a loved one's disappointment or anger,

as something that controls you. And you take someone else's expectations as something

that you have to follow. Now, that's not actually, not necessarily true. Most of the time,

it's not actually true. I mean, radically, it's not true. Even if someone is holding a gun to your

head, you don't have to do what they say. You just might have to live with the consequences,

or not live with the consequences, as it may be. But, you know, you have radical self-control.

We all do. We have radical self-control. But we don't feel like we do, because of physics and

consequences. And, you know, I know that if I do a certain thing, this person is going to get angry,

and that they're going to do whatever. And then that's not okay. That's not something that I want.

And so I'm going to choose this other thing. So we don't always acknowledge all these little

micro choices that are happening. And we feel like someone else is in control of us,

because we don't acknowledge that we are navigating an existing pattern that we see,

whether or not it's actually true, that can be debated. But we're navigating this kind of obstacle

course of other people's expectations, and emotions, and, you know, the consequences of,

well, if I do this, then this is going to happen. And I don't want that to happen,

so I'm not going to do this. But I don't feel like I have a choice in the matter.

I do. We're really talking about free will, kind of, in a way. It's just interesting.

Because that's not where I thought this conversation was going to go.

Yeah, exactly. So, Danielle, I'm feeling really excited about something that you just said a

moment ago, which I will paraphrase in my words, which are that I used to think that control

is power. But really, control is a pattern. And a pattern can be changed.

Did I say that? Did I say that?

Well, no, but you did. I don't know what you said, but it inspired that thought in me, because

we have been kind of saying, in a way, that we think that we control. And so, if we think we

control, we must think it has power. But it's not actually power, because we can't control.

But it is a pattern that feels powerful, or feels like power. And it's not like

we can't change, or move forward in what we think we control, how we think we control,

do we want to really control? I love this. I do. I think we conflate control and power.

But when I think of being empowered, I don't think of being in control of myself.

I think of being... There's something more fluid to it. Because controlling feels restricting.

If I'm thinking of like, even if I say, I'm in control, I don't feel like...

Control feels quite restricting. Whereas if I'm like, well, it's my choice to do whatever,

that doesn't feel control in the same... The word doesn't resonate the same way for me.

That feels more like a choice. It feels more powerful. It feels more conscious and intentional.

Whereas control feels always from the outside, for me. Which is weird, because you talk about

being in control. That's definitely from the inside. So that's just a personal little thing

I have. For me, control always comes from the outside for some reason. Which obviously is just

a personal quirk. Yeah, which I just want to say, it's so fantastic that we're viewing control from

different aspects. It makes me excited to think what others that would be listening... What is

their control? Not focus as in what it looks like in the outer world, but what initiates

that sense of control? Is it internal? Or is it external? Or is it both? It doesn't have to be

either or. But as you say, and I really agree, that control, it really is limiting our experience.

I want to live an unlimited life. I believe. That's my thought.

When I think of control, I'm usually thinking of it from a voice coach point of view.

Most of the time when I'm talking about control, I'm talking about... It often results in tension

in the body. So I'm trying to control things. I get tense. I'm not free. I'm not open. And my

expression suffers. My vocal tone suffers. My facial expressions, my body language suffer

because I'm trying to be in control and control creates tension.

So that's often how I'm thinking of things. And I know that a lot of people have different ideas.

I'd love to hear from people, what are your... Because this is the cool thing about language

is we all have these completely different perspectives on the same words. And I mean,

I understand dictionaries exist, but language is a living thing. And we all have our own

personal interpretation of different words. It reminds me of,

there's a chapter in The Unbearable Lightness of Being. And there's a chapter on internal

dictionaries and on how different words mean completely different things to different people.

And we're not in control of how other people interpret what we say even. Because when I say

something, I mean this, but you have your internal lexicon and your internal references and meanings

to things. So when I say something, you might see something or interpret it completely differently.

And this is why it's so funny when we think we're in control in relationships. We think,

I can control my spouse's feelings or sometimes we take responsibility for someone's, which is

control, just a different version of control. Like I'm responsible for someone else's happiness,

which means I'm in control of their happiness, which is of course ridiculous if we think about

it that way. But we do, we do it all the time. I can't do that, that'll make them unhappy.

I can't do this or I must do this because it'll make them happy. They're in control of their

own emotions. I do not get to control their emotions. I may be aware of certain patterns,

but it's just so fascinating.

It is fascinating, truly. And I love, I think you've probably alluded to this, Danielle, but

there's also the control that is choice. Because control can be one of those trigger words

that control equals bad. I'm just reminded of a couple of people that I've heard speak a while

ago saying that we call bad those parts of us that are really just trying to protect us. They're not

bad. Yes, they are, one could say, trying to control for our safety,

to limit for our safety, for those of us that safety is a big word. But yet, it's not bad.

Maybe everything is really for us, Danielle.

It's just that we get to choose what we want and what we don't. Sometimes something is for us,

but it hurts us unintentionally. That happens all the time with human beings in general.

My instinct might be to keep myself safe and to not make any risks, but that makes me unhappy

because then I'm living a kind of blah kind of life. It's done for my protection, it's done for

my safety, but it hurts me in a completely different way. So needing to look at things

holistically, but also very specifically to get that compassion, I think, that self-compassion.

Because control is really just, I guess it's just a choice in direction. If we come down to it,

you think of like, I play a lot of video games, like I've got the controller for the video game,

and I'm using it to move my little character around and make them turn left and make them

turn right. It's not any sort of insidious, mean, slave-making thing. It's the way that

I move my little guy around on the screen. If we think of it like that, it really is

just creating a movement or not creating a movement. I don't know where I was going with

that. I lost my train of thought. It's gone. Yeah. I think it's so cool. I love your analogy,

Danielle. I really do. Because in some ways, if the brain is a computer,

oh my dear, a whole other topic. But if the brain is a computer, sometimes we're directing,

and sometimes it appears something else is directing us. If I could have just a final word

here, and that is control or no control, let's have some compassion with ourself, which doesn't

mean that we will never change if that's something that we're wanting to do. It doesn't

mean we'll never transform, which is something we will do in various ways. But to just have

that self-compassion, because when I have more self-compassion, I tend to open a space of

creativity. I tend to open a space of actually what is possible. That's where I want to go.

What is possible, and I know that in self-love or in self-compassion,

I'm more likely to move in that direction than if I'm controlling myself with thoughts that are not

very helpful. I think whatever people choose, and this is for you, listeners,

whatever you choose your life to be, just own it. If you can own your choices,

you don't have to live a crazy, risky life, or there's nothing wrong with living a very safe

life if that's what you want. If you're happy, that's what's important, and I think

that can be the danger of giving control to other people is we kind of commit to being unhappy

because we want to make other people happy or something. I'm not sure. But owning your life

and letting yourself be whatever it is that gives you the most peace and the most joy and the most

satisfaction in your life, doing that. It just makes me think of, and I am not in any way

religious, but it makes me think of that serenity prayer. God, grant me the serenity to accept the

things I cannot change, courage to change the things that I can, and the wisdom to know the

difference. I think that is so huge because there are things that are very much in my control in my

life, and there are things that are not, and knowing that difference can, I think, be

that kind of the key to happiness in a way, accepting what isn't in our control and accepting

what is in our control and knowing what I'm responsible for, what I'm not responsible for.

And it's not that I can't affect change. I'm not responsible for the state of the world,

but I live in the world, and so I would like... But that's different. That's a choice. It's like,

I would like to affect change, and so I'm going to go out and do these things.

But I'm not in control. I'm not in control of world peace. I'm not. But I do as much as I can

in the small ways that I can to bring peace and emotional maturity to the folks around me,

because I want to live in a world that has those things. You know what I mean?

Yes, I do. That's beautiful, Danielle. I really appreciate that. I feel uplifted in my heart,

you know, for our conversation. I really do. You know, and that's the beautiful thing is

being able to share with others, you know, being willing to listen to others, be willing to

express. And, you know, we need each other. I really believe that we need connection,

and that we need to know we're also okay as we move through trying times that appear to want

to control us, but actually really don't have the power. They just have the pattern,

and the pattern can be changed. It's not power. It's a pattern,

and patterns can be changed. I love that. That's so beautiful. And I would like to invite everyone

who's listening, next time you feel unhappy or trapped or resentful, ask yourself,

where is the illusion? Where's the illusion of control happening in your life?

Where are you giving away your power? Where are you making a choice that doesn't feel like a choice?

Because you are in control of your life. And I'm not saying you're always going to be happy,

because that's absolutely not true. But you are in control of your life. And I do feel like the more

we recognize our autonomy, maybe we'll still feel pain. Definitely. We'll definitely still feel pain

in certain times. But there's a satisfaction that comes from owning your choices,

feeling like you are in control of your life. That helps. It's kind of a balm on it. So I invite you

to think about that. Wednesday, it's Wednesday. Oh, have we become the Addams Family?

Wednesday. Oh, how I would love to be Wednesday. Let's go on a little Tim Burton holiday. Wendy,

it has been an amazing conversation with you on a Wednesday, as usual. And yeah, just thank you.

Thank you so much. These are such thought provoking, beautiful, conscious conversations.

I really appreciate them.